Magic Jack - Good or Evil? - Comments Page 4

I've had magicjack since the beginning of the year with no problems until the end of Aug. Then suddenly we could no longer call out. This was being used primarily by my daughter (occasionally) and a friend (3 - 4 calls a day each 15 - 60 min long) We could get incoming calls but when you would call out it directed you to call another number from a phone (other than the magicjack) So I called it. They have decided I am making too many calls and now want to charge me a penny a minute! I did find one sentence in the TOS that mentions they can do this IF I make 20 times the normal user's number of calls! I'll be calling the BBB about this. I paid for 5 years of service but now can't use it! And they refuse to give me any proof of what calls were made to put me into the "excessive" use group!

quote: "But it's just not fair to extrapolate beyond the facts, and make unfounded claims that the company is doing evil or trampling on the privacy of their customers."

I realize this blog is about the OP's statements and what i'm about to say probably hasn't even entered the OP's thoughts but I know first hand that some people in Surrey which is a county in England who work for over 100 online websites use magic jack to sell prescription and/or counterfeit drugs to U.S. citizens. They call me over 20 times a day, many of them. I've never bought from them nor will I. What irritates me the most is that I'll get a call from 052460512 and of course i can't call that back or even begin to figure out any main number from that "so-called" phone number. It's great that people are saving a buck but as far as a person's rights or privacy, there is none with the users of magic jack and the device just opens the door for criminals to exploit the gullible. My main point is they provide service to criminals who I might add are being investigated by the FCC, FDA and DEA but then this story isn't about the morals of a company but you are defending them and I'm letting you know what's going on that people don't otherwise know about. I traced one of their numbers to YMAC using an online tracer. Information is a powerful tool but only when it's used.

Just wanted to tell you i have MJ and i have renewed my phone on the 2nd year now,i lost the software off it one,and they reinstalled it for me over the internet(no charge),the only problem i have alot of time is the quality of the call is not good but most the time it is okay,i change channel on my phone and all is well,i stand up for MJ they are a good company and that guy and his postings you investigated is so full of it...
happy to see you can explain to all the Mj customers,thanks
Vaugh

MagicJack has conveniently sold my MagicJack phone number to bill collectors. I know this because I've NEVER used my MJ # for ANYTHING except to call friends during hours where calls aren't free from my cell - in fact, I've stopped using it altogether for the past few months...

...today I checked my email to see that Chase Financial has left me a lovely message to let me know that I'm late on a payment.

When my year is up with MagicJack I'll know to buy another with cash from a store and use fake info in my registration.

@Jenna - there's always option #2 : PAY YOUR BILLS.

@Chase And maybe CHASE needs to know that the FTC does not like creditors harassing their victims in such a public manner. Something to the tune of up to $1,000 per violation that the victim can claim in a lawsuit.

EDITOR'S NOTE: You don't *really* believe that the previous commenter was an official representative of Chase Bank, do you?

My concern now that this product has been purchased and installed is that it puts a pop up window on my screen that says "tell your friends about magicjack and takes some time to go away. It also has taken it upon itself to make my internet favorites list available through it's menu. Why on earth would I want that function through a product meant to be used as a telephone not a web browser??? It makes me very uncomfortable. I also use different user accounts on my computer which are password protected and designed to sleep after a certain amount of time. I went to bed one night with the accounts screen open and woke up to my main account having opened itself with the magicjack window opened. This happens all the time since then. Why is my main user account opening without the use of the password being entered??? This seems very intrusive for w telephone service. Is there anyway to set the controls to limit what this program can and can not access/do in my computer?

By by your own statement:

It is true that the MJ TOS says they "may analyze the phone numbers you call and your registration information in order to improve the relevance of the ads."

This goes to prove that MagicJack is a great hype to install both spyware and adware on your computer system.

Hi,
re MJ spyware
I installed SnoopFree (www.snoopfree.com/ )
and when MJ started it attempted to access the text on open screens it did not own (and if allowed would continue to have access to new open screens)

This is clearly spyware and goes beyond the EUA statement that it only monitors phone numbers

MJ Support Chat Transcript:

Azael: Hello, how may I help you?

Larry: Hi,

Azael: May I know the exact nature of your problem with full details please?

Larry: Why does magicjack attempt to view/capture open windows it does not own?

Azael: What do you mean? Please be more specific.

Larry: on start of magicjack it attempts to capture the data from other windows it does not own (spyware?) I have a program that detects this!

Azael: Is your magicJack plugged in right now?

Larry: no because of the above problems!

Azael: We will work on your issue.

Azael: Please plug in the magicJack device now.

Larry: why, so you can identify me?

Azael: No.

Larry: SO PLEASE ANSWER MY QUESTION!

Azael: Can I ask what programs will open when you plug in your magicJack?

Larry: no,

Larry: MagicJack attempts to get content from other windows that are open, but belong to any other program, this is not normal or allowed (spyware?)

Azael: No, magicJack is not responsible for the said spyware.

Larry: but it you who are syping!

Azael: Once the magicJack is plug in, the softphone will run automatically wherein you can use to start making and receive calls.

Larry: there is no need for your program to look at other open windows!

Larry: please stop fogging me

Azael: I am not fogging you.

Azael: Once the magicJack is plug in, the softphone will run automatically wherein you can use to start making and receive calls.

Azael: There is no way will magicJack will open another program when it is plug in.

Larry: than answer why your program looks at open windows

**************************************

this continued for some more dialogs (ALL THE SAME)

And then got "upgraded" to a supervisor which sent me a link to please execute (it would delete magicjack from my computer. Yes be afraid!

EDITOR'S NOTE: Something about this post just doesn't seem to pass the smell test. Can anyone verify this claim that MJ might be reading info from other open windows? And is it even possible that a web link could completely remove a software package on a Windows system?

Hi,
I don't expect you or anyone to trust me.
Run the tests yourself!
That is why I provided the anti "hook" program link.
(ps it also catches logitech trying to monitor my keyboard ... is is ok as it has special hotkeys that I asked for.

Larry

Larry,

Are you a professional moron or just part time until you get your ankle bracelet off? Snoopfree is a "hack" utility that reads normal information that passes through a computer all the time i.e. shared files and resources. Quite often files or applications will not have all or even any of the same information. Most of this you do not see, because the programs and services start in the background and have finished doing so before snoopfree even starts. Sure, you found a link to snoopfree in a blog somewhere, but do you even know what it does or the technical purpose of the items it is reporting? I assume you don't, because if you had some technical sense, you would not have downloaded it in the first place. Did you know that snoopfree is just an advertising gimmick to get you to download real spyware? Did you know that if you uninstall snoopfree that it remains on your PC and sets its permission to "deny all", so you can't remove it? Go get yourself a "smart" keyboard with lots of hotkeys or better yet, a combo printer that registers itself as 3 different USB devices and see what happens. Snoopfree will probably go crazy and report nothing more than the normal operation of your PC and disguise it as a threat. The open window being reported is inconsequential information without an exact explanation of which window is being referenced and why. One more thing to try, why I'm thinking about it... find the exit button on snoopfree to shut it off... yes my friend, you've been had, not to mention the fact that you were a jerk for the stunt you pulled with magicJack.

Regards,

Donnie

I just tried this using snoopfree, and yes larry is right it does access text on open screens it does not own. I anm removing this from my PVC and blocking it from the net and trusted zones with zone alarm. BTW when I unplugled the magic jack the list of attempted access stopped, but until then it was trying 330 times a second to access the screens it did not own once i blocked it. I wish I could post screen shots here. I only bought this last monday, so I'm going to try to take it back, but it will NOT be on my PC unless I have a dedicated one for only it. I was afraid it was too good to be true. Everyone should try this and see for themselves, especially the reviewer. I may have to start a blogging again myself just for this.

Bob,

I was reading your article with enthusiasm until you said the following gaffe:

It's important to remember that ANY piece of software on your computer has the ability to access ANY file on that system. Your web browser, word processor, email program, even your anti-virus program -- they all have carte blanche to read, write, change, delete or transmit anything on your computer. But that doesn't mean they will.

Unless you assume we are all running Windows 98, a program cannot access ANY file on the system. Also, especially in Windows Vista, Seven, and Mac OS X, various pieces of software have various levels of access to your computer. This is the most fundamental aspect of OS security today and if you are a technical blogger, you should at least learn the basics. You could correct the statement to read: "any file in your user folders".

EDITOR'S NOTE: Not so sure about that. If a user is logged in as an Admin level user, then that changes everything, right? Also, viruses can certainly wreak whatever havoc they want, in any folder...

Donnie

A moron? Perhaps for buying Magicjack.
Also for spending too much time writing system internal apps such as drivers and not spending my time on the beach.

No voip program needs to look at other program's data. Searching codeproject or other development sites will show both how to hook and what hooks are all about. Much like a locksmith has ways to open locks, he should not be opening all the houses on the block to see what is inside. MJ does look inside!

Larry

For anyone interested in using it for a fax line, it may or may not work. I've read countless posts on both sides of the fence. It's not working for me...tried screwing with it for a couple of hours and the most I get is the first inch of the page when sending, then the MagicJack hangs up on it's own for some reason. Won't receive at all. Tried it with the built in fax-modem and a real fax machine. I don't really fax that much so it's not a big deal.

Voice quality was never a problem, although I haven't really used it extensively since last year. Audio cuts out once in awhile but don't remember a substantial number dropped calls. They do disconnect you if you stay on a call for 2 or 3 hours (can't remember which) but you can just re-dial after a minute or so. I have heard of people being required to pay for excessive usage (over a couple thousand minutes).

I don't really know to what extent they spy on users and the software seems questionable at best (12+ MB just for their cheezy dialer software). If you're concerned about privacy, consider putting it on it's own computer (build a thin client to save power & money) and then you have nothing to worry about, other than perhaps the hassle of getting it to work on the thin client. I still prefer an analog line myself, but it also costs me a bit more than if I were to use the MagicJack exclusively.

This article is fairly accurate. One of the only things that annoys me about the magic jack software is its habit of loading several processes just to check the status of the magic jack device. It enters itself deep within the registry where most users wouldn't think to look, and sets itself to start when windows starts. Every time I remove it from the registry and restart the software, it puts its registry entries right back where they were. And it actually does slow down the computer a little, assuming the processor is slow, even when the device isn't plugged in. Windows takes at least twice as long to load up all of its processes thanks to magic jack, even on the best machines. And no, there is no uninstaller. It also installs to the documents and settings folder, not program files. Most people wouldn't think to look for it there.
Also, there doesn't seem to be a fair usage limit. Last time I read the terms of service, they had some nonsense about 20 times the normal usage. Ok, so how the hell are we supposed to know what everyone else and their grandmother uses per day? I've also heard of several people having their service cut off without notice because they went over this undefined usage limit, and being forced to pay not only for a new plan, but for a new magic jack in order to have the service restored. That, in my opinion, is just disgustingly poor practices on their part.

I do have to give them one thing though. Their support is generally good, even though it is only web-based. They give the user everything they promise, even though those promises aren't always clearly spelled out. So if the user reads through all the legalese and other such things that comprise the terms of service, they will get exactly what they are expecting. Personally, I don't use mine very often, so I haven't been cut off at all. I think I will renew mine in June since it's fairly cheap, and it's useful to have around, especially with cell phone rates as bad as they are in Canada. The best combination you can possibly get is a small netbook, a mobile internet air card and a magic jack.

I don't have time to reply to this right now but, I must say. This annoys me. I was on my laptop the other day and magicjack was unplugged and plugged in my main computer. I was on youtube and when the video stopped I heard someone saying something. I turned it up and heard okay to get your data now. I reached up and diconnect internet. I heard, no don't go off, no don't go. I looked up who was excessing my data, and it was magicjack. Mcafee had been blocking attempts but the got threw from another IP address. Hacking threw magicjacks IP maybe. Or just magicjack doing what people are saying. I could here him! He was deep into my system. I wonder if they get into web cams. I am canceling my subscribtion and deleting everything I can. Then i am going to run over my magicjack with a lawn mower. I bet they know I am saying this.

EDITOR'S NOTE: Wow. You're either a very talented fiction writer, a person with an axe to grind, or you have problems that no amount of tech support can solve.

Bob,

Thank you for injecting some common sense into the spyware debate surrounding Magic Jack. I usually look at simple to-good-to-be-true devices like this with a very skeptical eye. As a privacy lobbyist myself I know there are so many ways in which many unknowingly give up their information that, if they fully understood the extent to which they do so, it would make them head for the hills, crawl up in a cave and live in seclusion the rest of their miserable lives. And you're right - SnoopFree is an oxymoron on so many levels it's comical.

"Common sense" is also an oxymoron because it's just not that common anymore. But that's what's prescribed here. The suggestion for the paranoid to get a cheap XP machine and dedicate it to MJ service exclusively is probably the best one out there.

I have actually had pretty good service with mine and, unlike many, did not set my customer service expectations unrealistically high for the only $20/yr price tag. They have to cut cost somewhere and labor, being the greatest cost of running ANY business, is where they chose to cut. From the business perspective, that was a good move. It's a good value, even if we CAN hear the East Indian accent through the chat text window. :-P

That said, I must also point out that I was not pleased with the intrusive pop-up windows I encountered upon entering your web site to read your MJ common sense. You may want to think about practicing what you preach, else be labeled as clergy, "Do as I say, not as I do."

IMHO
Z

Bob, can you please explain the challenge used to authenticate the user using the SIP protocol on the magic jack? Could packet sniffing outside the computer identify this info or only a trojan running locally possibly?